best briks??
Posted by: candle1966
Date: 30/4/2003 08:03:00

hello all, even mr parry, i'm pondering on getting a set of briks as i have a bit of a bass probelm with my room, and would welcome any advice on which year to go for and any other info i may need before purchase, all advice gratefully recieved,
cheers dave,[:)]


Re: best briks??
Posted by: John and my dog Jake
Date: 30/4/2003 09:34:00

hi,
I regard early Bariks as the best sounding, passive with the crossover inside behind the B139.
New tweeters have been fitted to later models and I have heard very good reports on this channel but I have not personally heard them, I do like my Scanspeaks however.

If you have a bass problem I believe it could be tailored by using active Bariks.
Active users here could perhaps advise on this course.

A great choice of speaker anyway.

john


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Paul Ranson
Date: 30/4/2003 22:07:00

For snob value I believe the best Briks are considered to be the banana'd ones with the pair of 8 Ohm crossovers under a removeable panel in the base. Late 80s vintage.

These give the fairly easy option of active/passive operation and still allow passive biamping using a power amp to drive each half of the loudspeaker.

Paul


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Ed
Date: 30/4/2003 23:20:00

Dave's Briks...

[:D]

Sue


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Tony Lonorgan
Date: 1/5/2003 00:15:00

Quote:
For snob value I believe the best Briks are considered to be the banana'd ones with the pair of 8 Ohm crossovers under a removeable panel in the base. Late 80s vintage.


Those were the ones I had. My guess / hunch is these are the best speakers, but not the best crossovers. I would love to hear a pair with the earlier and smaller non-triwired crossover.

Tony.



Canon/XLR Briks
Posted by: TanaisFox
Date: 1/5/2003 08:39:00

There's an undeniable warmth to the older DMS Canon/XLR Briks, but they tend to lose the plot with wooly bass (Try the opening track of System 7's System Express - which bottoms the B139s out easily on any pre 8 x banana socket Briks. There are solutions to this which involve hanging very powerful amps off of them (not for volume but control), and using custom Mana supports which extends their ability to "do bass" (i.e. you get an actual note and a start/stop over very very low notes) -- this took a lot of work and a complete ditching of the amps I was using, but perhaps not as much work as rewiring or getting a last-model set of Bariks and removing all that KuStone shite from inside. Bariks will work with 250s and 135s but only up to a point -- and this is not dictated by volume either. Hard work and good amps will pay handsomely with these speakers.

I have Higher Intelligence Agency's --"Message from the Higher Intelligence" from their excellent first LP Colourform. Naim's Amps struggle -- through NAP135s the bass has a single monotone note in (I think) C# and the drivers sound a bit rattling (only another Brik owner will know how awful this sounds). The note was louder then quieter then louder. When I replaced the NAP135s with Avondale M1s, I noticed it now has a sliding note from C# down to C -- all at the same volume -- thats a sign of an Amp exerting sufficient control over the Briks.

I used to get this sort of artefact all the time with NAP250s on Briks which was why I moved away from Naim amps because they do not have the control I think Briks need. Another example, the bass notes behind the bass drum on 3recur from Plaid's "Rest Proof Clockwork" (which now do that enveloping you in surround sound Bass thing that Briks can do so well) but on NAP250s rattled the entire enclosure and stayed resolutely "over there in the region of the HiFi"...

I run quite old Canon/XLR Briks Passive on custom Mana supports but I generally haven't heard Active Briks do better than mine.

Hope this helps


Re: Canon/XLR Briks
Posted by: ndbaker
Date: 1/5/2003 08:46:00

Hi Fox

Thats good to hear, I am at present building a pair of amps with 3 Avondale NCC200 amp units in to drive my Briks actively. From the sound of it they should be up to the job. I have whilst waiting for the cases to come been driving them passively with a psuedo NAP 250 with 2 NCC200 and they walk all over the re-capped 250 that was there before.

Cheers

Nick


Re: Canon/XLR Briks
Posted by: Alan Ball
Date: 1/5/2003 09:28:00

Fox -

The HIA track is "Ketamine Entity".. and it is a speaker killer.

The freq of the sub note is too low for a CD to accurately reproduce without amazing amounts of bass-flubberness.. I have never heard a system where it doesn't lose the plot here (Although not heard it post-Mana). I'd love to hear Colourform on vinyl one day !! [:D]

-A-


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Martin
Date: 1/5/2003 09:46:00

Quote:
Those were the ones I had. My guess / hunch is these are the best speakers, but not the best crossovers. I would love to hear a pair with the earlier and smaller non-triwired crossover



Tony, I'm confused.

Did you have a pair with the twin internal 8-ohm crossovers (as Paul mentions), or the later ones with external tri-wirable boards?

cheers, Martin


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Mick Parry
Date: 1/5/2003 10:31:00

Chaps

I have a pair of 1986 Briks with the XLR connector.

I have them powered by a pair of chrome bumpered 135's (just serviced by Naim) and they sound great.

They were fine when powered by a 250, but the 135's gave them a much more effortless presentation. I would imagine a NAP 500 would be really good.

Briks really fill the room with sound like no other speaker that I have heard.

Plonking them on a pair of Mana stands was a worthwhile improvement.

Regards

Mick


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Dev Banerji
Date: 1/5/2003 10:46:00

>>>Plonking them on a pair of Mana stands was a worthwhile improvement.

Improvement in what way? They looked better?

Dev


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Mick Parry
Date: 1/5/2003 10:56:00

Dev

I have to say you are becoming a little anti Mana.

Regards

Mick


Re: best briks??
Posted by: PatrickD
Date: 1/5/2003 10:58:00

I too thought (from other posts) that you had the crossover-in-the-stand bariks, Tony.

Except for the single crossover and the panelled stands, is there actually any difference between the banana plugged types (discounting the addition of Ku-stone to the final version which nobody appears to like)?

I assume that moving the crossover position from internal, to in-the-base, to in-the-stand, was a production (rather than a sonic) improvement, since it makes conversion between PMS and DMS versions practical at dealer and user level?

Question: do the crossover-in-the-stand versions have 3 or 4 pairs of banana sockets? Do they still have the cavity in the base where the pair of crossovers went?

How are all your foam grills doing? - please see my "Isobarik Grills" thread. (A "no thanks" would also be useful to gauge interest, or lack of it!)

My new-to-me bariks are the '87 crossover-in-the-base version. I can't tell a 'C', so I guess it's ok to drive them with 135s? [;)]


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Dev Banerji
Date: 1/5/2003 11:10:00

Mick wrote:

'I have to say you are becoming a little anti Mana.'

I am not anti Mana at all - I am merely anti-condescending people.

regards

Dev


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Paul Ranson
Date: 1/5/2003 11:26:00

Quote:
When I replaced the NAP135s with Avondale M1s, I noticed it now has a sliding note from C to D-Sharp

Fox in tune dem alert!!!!!!!

But actually quoting pitches is well too nerdy for us tone deaf commoners.

Paul


Re: best briks??
Posted by: Paul Ranson
Date: 1/5/2003 11:33:00

Quote:
Question: do the crossover-in-the-stand versions have 3 or 4 pairs of banana sockets? Do they still have the cavity in the base where the pair of crossovers went?

I believe 'crossover in stand' speakers have three pairs, but still have the cavity.

This was certainly Hermann Esser's experience, he installed Falcon crossovers in his later style Briks.

FWIW there are at least three types of crossover, XLR style speakers have this type mounted in the Isobarik cavity,



4 pairs of 4mm, two 8 Ohm crossovers in the base look like this,



I don't have a convenient photo of the 4 Ohm crossover. It's big and green with yellow caps and fills the plan form of the stand....

Paul



Re: best briks??
Posted by: John and my dog Jake
Date: 1/5/2003 13:06:00

hi,
the falcon suplied/ genuine early linn crossovers mounted behind the B139 are similar to the above cavity ones but do appear to be of a different component arrangement.

john


Re: Choon Dem Alert
Posted by: TanaisFox
Date: 1/5/2003 02:25:00

Well there you go there Avondale beats the Naim hands down in a choon dem - with the impediment of apparently choon killing Mana stands.

>But actually quoting pitches is well too nerdy for us tone deaf
>commoners.

Indeed it may be too nerdy for someone like you who admits he tweaks his active crossover but it suprised the fuck out of me when I put the Avondale M1s in and found out it was actually a sliding scale rather than the monotone "Dooooomb" sound via the NAP250s, 135s, LK280/Sparks and 5105s...

Alan,

Ahh yes... Ketamine Entity, glad you've heard it/got it because you might have some kind of idea what I'm banging on about... its actually a great track on vinyl (and you are welcome to sample it after a skinful) up here -- getting tracks like that to sound right has been a challenge... another flubber-butster that actually switched off NAP135s with Briks after 10 minutes is this one:



Guerilla in Dub on 2 x Vinyl makes Bariks do very very very silly things also makes SBLs make very curious honking/farty noise...

I assume honking fart noises are supported in the choon dem and are okay if its a flat-earth kind of honking fart....


Re: Choon Dem Alert
Posted by: Mick Parry
Date: 1/5/2003 02:29:00

Clive

Naim beats everything hands down especially soldering iron jobbies.

Sorry fact of life.

Mick


Mick rises to the bait
Posted by: TanaisFox
Date: 1/5/2003 02:34:00

But not apparently Avondale M1s it seems (unless you like monotonic bass)...

>especially soldering iron jobbies.

So Naim don't use soldering Irons? This is a recent application for wuffle dust I assume?


Re: Mick rises to the bait
Posted by: Mick Parry
Date: 1/5/2003 02:38:00

Clive my little tinkerer

Avondale are possibly better than stealths.

x

Mick


being really honest
Posted by: TanaisFox
Date: 1/5/2003 02:42:00

The M1s I used (and Stumo's M2s) certainly give STEALTH a run for their money -- which is not suprising seeing how they all absolutely thrash those silly Salisbury antiques you insist on pretending are any good [;)]


Changing the subject
Posted by: Jiiim
Date: 1/5/2003 03:00:00

...a flat-earth kind of honking fart....


I guess this means you can clearly hear when it starts and stops.


Yuck.



Re: Choon Dem Alert
Posted by: Paul Ranson
Date: 1/5/2003 03:12:00

Quote:
Well there you go there Avondale beats the Naim hands down in a choon dem - with the impediment of apparently choon killing Mana stands.

The choon killing Mana effect is someone else's view. I'm surprised you take it so seriously.

FWIW I believe that Avondale power amps are effectively reimplemented Naims. ISTM that if you like Naim you'll probably like Avondale, and vice versa, especially when compared to the rather different approaches of Linn, Stealth/ECS, etc.

Paul


Re: Choon Dem Alert
Posted by: Carl Nyqvist
Date: 2/5/2003 10:25:00

Quote:
Chaps, I have a pair of 1986 Briks with the XLR connector

Mick,
I am not questioning your information but I think, or at least I did until I saw your post, that the 4mm bananas were introduced earlier than 1986. No? Thanks to anyone who can shed some light on this.

Cheers
Carl


Re: Choon Dem Alert
Posted by: John and my dog Jake
Date: 2/5/2003 12:44:00

hi,
my restoration pair have a no. which puts them at late march 1984 with XLR's and internal crossovers.
Information from Falcon.

john


Briks and vintage etc
Posted by: Mick Parry
Date: 2/5/2003 12:55:00

Carl

I purchased the Briks 12 months or so from a chap whose Grandfather had just died.

The Gradfather owned the Briks, a complete Naim system and a shed load of classical CD's.

I bought the Briks and another chap bought the Naim.

The grandfather doted on his system and was the original owner of the Briks. I have the receipt of his purchase dated 1986 and the rear connection is XLR.

Thats all I call really say.

Regards

Mick


viewing 1990 briks
Posted by: candle1966
Date: 2/5/2003 02:29:00

thanks one and all for the advice, i'm viewing a pre kustone set on sat pm, any more thuoghts on the attributes of briks, such as warmth or openness will be welcome,
cheers dave[:D]


Vintage grandfather
Posted by: Carl Nyqvist
Date: 6/5/2003 01:09:00

Quote:
Carl

I purchased the Briks 12 months or so from a chap whose Grandfather had just died.

The Gradfather owned the Briks, a complete Naim system and a shed load of classical CD's.

I bought the Briks and another chap bought the Naim.

The grandfather doted on his system and was the original owner of the Briks. I have the receipt of his purchase dated 1986 and the rear connection is XLR.

Thats all I call really say.

Regards

Mick

Mick

The man pass away and next thing you are there taking his coffins [;)] . I hope you got the classical CDís as well.

Cheers
Carl



When you are dead you are dead
Posted by: Mick Parry
Date: 6/5/2003 07:23:00

Carl

Sentiment has no place in business.

The Briks were a good buy and are a testament to the way in which he looked after them.

I have kicked myself a hundred times for not buying the CD's. They were all recommended by the Grampohone mag and they were up for grabs at £750.00 the lot.

Regards

Mick